The Learning Leader Show with Ryan Hawk
www.LearningLeader.com
New Book -- The Price of Becoming
www.LearningLeader.com/Becoming
Austin Kleon is the NYT bestselling author of Steal Like an Artist, Show Your Work, and Keep Going. He's a writer who draws, a former librarian, and one of the most original thinkers on creativity working today. His new book is Don't Call It Art: 10 Ways to Create Like a Kid Again.
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Key Learnings
Stay light. Bill Murray told ballplayers that if you stay light, loose, and relaxed, you can play at the highest level. Same with acting, writing, anything. Austin keeps a photo of Bill in his studio as a reminder.
Play is the work. A lot of Austin's best work requires a sense of play. It's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins.
Go to the analog desk first. Austin has a digital desk and an analog desk. Nothing electronic is allowed at the analog desk. He starts there with nothing and sees what comes.
Most people never give themselves the time, space, and materials to make something of what's swirling inside them.
People want to watch someone who is activated. "People will pay every night to show up and see somebody believe in themselves." (Kim Gordon, Sonic Youth)
The market for something to believe in is infinite. (Hugh MacLeod) The world is full of people just doing their thing. They're hungry to see someone on fire for something.
The writer's job: take what everyone is thinking and put it into words. "You gave me the words" is the highest compliment a reader can give.
Effortless is earned. People say the Friday newsletter looks easy. Austin's reply: Do it every Friday for 13 years, then call me.
A place to put things makes you notice more. Thoreau took morning walks knowing he'd write later, so he paid closer attention. Carry a camera, and you start seeing shots everywhere.
Live for the living, not for the writing. There's a tension between living your life and documenting it. Don't lose yourself to the feed.
Your attention is the most valuable thing you have. Everyone wants to take it. The real challenge of modern life is making sure you're the one who decides where it goes.
The best teachers are perpetual students. You realize what you know and don't know only when you try to teach it.
Toggle between knowing and not knowing. The moment you think you know what you're doing, the work gets stale. You start running on routine instead of need.
To be an amateur is to be a lover. The French root means "lover of." An amateur does it out of love, not material reward.
Every great CEO should be put in a room with a four-year-old. They'd both learn something. Kids knock the pompous certainty right out of you.
"I don't know. How do you think we should figure it out?" Austin's kids taught him it's less important to know everything than to know how to find out.
The leader isn't the one who speaks while everyone listens. The leader listens, asks questions, stays curious, and wonders how everyone is doing.
Look for who's having fun, not who's successful. Fun is underrated. Serious people have a serious time. Do it with lightness and it's contagious.
"A master in the art of living draws no sharp distinction between his work and his play." (Lawrence Pearsall Jacks) He hardly knows which is which. He simply pursues his vision of excellence through whatever he's doing and leaves others to decide whether he's working or playing. To himself, he always appears to be doing both.
Ask "What does the universe want to show me today?" A useful fiction. Tell yourself the world is trying to send you messages and suddenly you see a hundred of them.
Have the toy before you know what you'll do with it. Austin buys typewriters, then asks what to make. Get the bicycle first. In six months you'll know what kind you actually want.
Steal an idea someone only did once and turn it into a whole thing. Austin saw a single typewriter interview, made it a series, and has done more than 20.
Put the human hand in the work. Austin decided 20 years ago to make it obvious a human made his stuff. In the age of AI, it stands out more than ever. People want the imperfection.
Writing is thinking. People think you gather your ideas then write them down. The act of writing is the act of figuring out what you actually think. That's the hard part.
Differentiate yourself by reading a book outside your field. Swim a little further out than everyone else and you find new water.
Focus on what you can control. A writer controls only what's between the covers. Did you do a good job? Were you clear? Were you helpful? The rest isn't up to you.
Austin's champagne moment a year from now: his kids flourishing. The older he gets, the less the books mean and the more his family does.
Reflection Questions
- Where is your analog desk? Do you have a space with no screens where you go to make something of what's swirling inside you?
- Are you activated? When people watch you work, do they see someone on fire for it, or someone just going through the motions?
- What's one idea from outside your field you could steal this week? Where could you swim a little further out and find new water?
More Learning
#676: Jesse Cole - Built for the Fans, Obsession & Excellence#687: Jim Collins - What to Make of a Life#241: Austin Kleon - How to Steal Like an Artist
Podcast Chapters
00:00 The Price of Becoming - Pre-Order Now!
01:33 Meet Austin Kleon
02:53 The Bill Murray Photo: Stay Light
05:42 The Analog Desk: Where the Real Work Starts
08:51 People Want to Watch Someone Activated
15:22 Why "It Looks Easy" Is the Whole Point
16:28 The Newsletter as a Forcing Function to Notice
20:46 Who Owns Your Attention?
24:39 How Austin's Kids Became His Teachers
29:06 Why the Best Creators Stay Amateurs
31:33 Curiosity Is the Real Leadership Skill
34:09 What Does the Universe Want to Show Me Today?
35:02 Look for Who's Having Fun, Not Who's Successful
38:30 Do You Love to Write, or Love to Have Written?
41:00 The Typewriter Interviews: Stealing an Idea Done Once
47:18 The Interplay of Analog and Digital
49:02 AI and Why the Human Hand Wins
51:23 The Champagne Question: Family Flourishing
55:47 Walk-Ins Welcome
58:06 EOPC